Brembo GT Big Brake Kit.

[macfly]

I just fitted these gorgeous brakes to my car. They are beautifully made, and they look as if they should have been part of the car from the factory, unlike the unsightly OEM brakes which I always felt let the car down visually. I chose my calipers in silver because I wanted to keep a unifed look to the car, but you can also get them with Red & Black calipers.

They pedal feel is rock solid, and the car pulls up in short order with little effort, but I'll be able to give more feedback once I've had a chance to get her out on the open road.

[robz82001]

.....Andrew, I can't believe how homely the OEM brake components look compared to your set-up. Is there ANY brake out there that you know of that will fit the Z8's OEM wheel? I really love the OEM wheels and have resisted changing them....but I'm so tempted to go to 19s if I can get those gorgeous Brembos. Thanks so much for sharing!!!

[macfly]

Rob, you could try calling Robert Lee @ StopTech - 310-325-4799 x 106.

They used to make a system for the Z8, but it was withdrawn because of rear axle bearing compatibilty issues leading to pad knock back on some of the early cars. It is my understanding that these issues were eliminated on later cars (01 onwards) which had much beefier axle-interior mounted rear wheel bearings. There had been some interest in getting StopTech to re-launch the kit over on Roadfly a year or so ago, but I'm not sure if anything ever came of it.

You can see some shots of the original system here on my old car.

[thegunguy]

Beatiful Andrew - the only thing nicer would be the Cartridge versions.

Looking forward to feeling their performance next week!

[Z8doc]

Andrew,

Very nice indeed -- time to update the Avatar?

[macfly]

After a 400 mile drive, including 100 miles at the track, this is the news;

The pedal feel is much better, the car stops really hard under full braking, it really is like throwing an anchor out back, and overall I feel it looks much better too, so I can give this upgrade a full two thumbs up.

[thegunguy]

I'm really surprised how little dust collected on the front wheels after a day at the track. While it seemed like there were only three or four turns that required heavier braking on entry, it's amazing to do 100 miles on a track and have the wheels looking almost as clean as at the beginning of the day.

[macfly]

You are right, we did 400 miles in the car, yet there is only a very slight dusting, nothing like the grime the OEM set up would have deposited over the same 400 miles.

[Bend]

Andrew,
I noticed the remarkable lack of brake dust, too. It was all the more significant, since I had recently switched out to Centric Posi-Quiet pads to deposit less brake dust on my wheels (http://bmwz8.us/vbb/showthread.php?t=817). I have been very impressed by how much less brake dust that I have had with these pads compared to my old OEM pads; yet, when I looked at my wheels at the end of the track day, they were almost black and I had to look hard to see any dust on your wheels.
Brembos stop great, look great ... and they're tidy, too

[macfly]

A nice shot of the Brembo's with Dave's RD-2 19" rims.

[Norcal]

Silver calipers look really nice

[dwz8]

Andrew, are you using SUV springs at the rear? Looks quite high, doesn't it?

[macfly]

That is the EU Alpina suspension - see here

I think that your eye may be tricked by an optical illusion, as there is no light on the tire, so the gap looks much larger, but it seems about the same as the Dave's car above on stock springs - I think you are just used to looking at your low, low K&W kitted car.

[dwz8]

That is the EU Alpina suspension - see here

I think that your eye may be tricked by an optical illusion, as there is no light on the tire, so the gap looks much larger, but it seems about the same as the Dave's car above on stock springs - I think you are just used to looking at your low, low K&W kitted car.

You're right, it's the light. I had a second look.
But then I am spoiled anyway...

[thegunguy]

But then I am spoiled anyway...

[Z8doc]

When you guys switched to the Big Brakes... what brake fluid did you install? Did you stay with the BMW Brake fluid or did you switch to a performance brake fluid with higher boiling points?

Just curious as I am gearing up for the install and my dealer does not carry anything but the BMW fluid.

[macfly]

I use the same Motul 600 in my Z8 that I have used in all my track cars (M3/GT3./Lotus).

[dwz8]

I use ATE Blue High Performance. You should definitely not use the regular brake fluid if you intend to put these brakes to good use.

[Z8doc]

Thanks Deiter and Andrew,

Ignorant question but how much fluid do I need to buy? They both come in 1/2 liter containers or buy the case. How much to exchange the OEM Brake Fluid for the performance when bleeding the brakes?

Andrew, the Motul states do NOT mix with polyglycol brake fluids or Silicone based fluids. I know the BMW fluid is synthetic but not Silicone based. Can I assume that the BMW fluid is NOT a polyglycol brake fluid too, since you used it in your set up and did not have a problem? Also, what color is the Motul?

One advantage of the Super Blue is that during the exchange, you can just keep pumping it in until the old BMW fluid turns blue to know you have fully exchanged
the fluid. How many miles or time do go between changing the brake fluid out?

[macfly]

I used the ATE Super Blue in the GT3 for a bit too, it is a great product, it just happens that the Motul is easier to get locally for some reason. You need to do quite a bit of whatever you get because the brakes and clutch share a reservoir, so don't forget to flush the clutch while you're at it. I always buy by the case, just simpler that way, but about one bottle should do the entire system.

[Z8doc]

guide to help those interested in getting this upgrade, to assist them in making sure the calipers fit whatever wheels they may choose to get.

As stated previously, you MUST upgrade your wheels if you are going to upgrade to the Gran Turismo Brembo Big Brake Kit (you can get Brembo performance replacement rotors for your Z8 but they will not be bigger but offer better performance than the OEM rotors).

Take the measurements listed here and apply them to the wheel diagram / profile. Then measure your wheels to check the fitment. I found it useful to make a cutout of sorts out of cardboard that uses the dimensions given to then place them in the back of the wheel from the hub out to see if it hit anywhere (BTW, the center hub of the z8 measures 74mm in diameter -- useful too for wheel fitment in order to avoid a hub spacer).

GT Brembo Front 380mm x 34mm with 8 piston caliper
A: 37mm B: 125mm C: 218mm
Requires 19" wheel or greater for Z8 application

GT Brembo Rear 345mm x 28mm with 4 piston caliper
A: 28mm B: 119mm C: 200mm
Requires 19" wheel or greater for Z8 application

[Z8doc]

Well, I finally got it done.

The installation went really great with no problems except one. The rear dust shield would not allow the rear caliper to fit properly and would rub. To remove it required removal of the rear wheel hub do to keep it simple, my mechanic just suggested and I agreed, to simply cut off the rear dust shield low enough to allow the caliper and center cap to clear and fit properly. Not sure if Dave and Andrew had to do this step or not.

The wheels are Beyern Type 5. For those who do not know, Beyern is produced by TSW, who specializes in Staggered fitments for many makes and models. The Beyern wheels, are specifically designed to to fit BMW in staggered fitments. They come in 18 - 20 inch and mulitple widths and offsets and hub diameters of 72 and 74mm (the Z8 is 72mm). They do not require spacers or hub centric rings to make them fit unless you go outside your stock offset or hub diameter.

My wheels are Beyern Type 5 in 20x8.5 with 20mm offset front, and 20x10 with 20mm offset rear. The silver finish matched the car perfectly. I like the curved 5 spoke design as it is classic and consistent with the overall car theme yet more aggressive than the OEM wheel. It's spokes are beveled on the edge just enough to catch the light for stunning photographs (a friend recently told me to always remember the light !) and the polished edge adds just the right amount of accent to the chrome on the Z8, IMHO. Also, high end wheels here in Oklahoma are few and far between but these wheels are easily replaceable.

One thing with the wheels I did not expect was how light they are. Beyern told me they weigh 29.5 lbs front and 34 lbs rear. However, when I picked them up and held them, they seemed lighter so I personally weighed them. The front wheel weighed only 24.5 lbs and the rear only 29.5!! That is nearly 8 lbs a corner of unsprung weight and I can feel it when going down the road. The lightness of the wheel combined with the stiffer smaller sidewall of the Michelin PS2s, is a very nice compliment to the Dinan Stage 3 Suspension I have and so far -- I like it alot.

I have not really had a chance to test the brakes today as it has been raining on and off and they are not bedded in fully yet. I did order but did NOT install a set of the Centric Posi-Quiet brake pads, which were recommended by Brakewarehouse as the best low dust pad for this application -- BUT... they did not FIT the front calipers. Turns out, that there is NOT a replacement Centric pad for the GT - 8 Piston. The pad they make (the one they sent me) fits the Brembo 6 piston caliper, which is on the Audi RS4. The only production vehicle that apparently uses the GT 8 cailper is the VW Toureg, and only available as a performance upgrade -- according to Dave Zeckhausen, whom I called to get advise when the pads did not fit. So, for now, I will have to put up with some dust.

Can't wait though to get some seat time and let er rip!

Pictures below:

[Dogsbreath]

Nice Jeff !

If you had removed the rear dust shield you would not have been able to mount your ebrake. I cut my dust shields back. I am using 15mm spacers but I like the idea of these wheels.

Looks awesome

Dave P

[Bend]

Hi Jeff,
Your combo looks great!
Your description will make it that much easier for anyone in the future to duplicate the great results. Thanks for the pics and the your, as usual, thorough explanation.
Ted

[thegunguy]

Okay, I'm lost. Andrew's Brembos came with slotted rotors, and Dave and Jeff have drilled. Is there a choice?

[Dogsbreath]

Yup, just tell them how you would like them. You can even opt for slotted and cross drilled I believe.

Dave P

[KenZ8]

Jeff,
Beautiful result. It looks like the car should have had that combination from the beginning. I hope it stops raining near you so you can enjoy the upgrade.

[Z8doc]

Okay, I'm lost. Andrew's Brembos came with slotted rotors, and Dave and Jeff have drilled. Is there a choice?

want. But alas, the drilled AND slotted rotors are NOT available on this GT 8 pistion front, 4 piston rear set up.

The drilled and slotted ones you sometimes see are for smaller rotors and Brembo does not recommend them for these larger ones for reasons unknown.

The drilled holes and slots are oriented the same but it is an optical illusion on the drilled ones that the rear holes curve forward and the fronts curve to the rear. In reality, the holes follow the vents in the center of the rotor (so do the slots) and the vents are oriented to slope to the rear from center hub to the rear as you get to the top of rotor (outside edge)-- hope that makes sense.

[macfly]

A quick look at Norcal's specially painted blue Brembo set up and my silver ones. A few years on and I'm still loving mine, and think they look much more correct on the car than the standard calipers.

[thegunguy]

The Roundel blue looks great with Norcal's unique look.

[Norcal]

Andrew, you even lined up our tires!

I really love the Brembos too. Not that the car wouldn't stop before, but they look great and feel great, and they're lighter, and they won't give up the ghost at the track for sure.

[redz8]

The blue/black combo looks great. Well done!

[Z8-NL]

and mine are RED

[Z8Mania]

I think the blue look great because it appears you matched the blue from the Roundel. The red give great contrast against the black and Andrew's silver look great with his silver car. Theres no doubt the stock brakes look puny inside larger wheels. I've been thinking of going with a new set of brakes but I think I will make that next years upgrade. This year Im doing the Dinan caster/ camber plates. They go on in a few weeks.

[tomfakes]

What brake options are there for the stock wheels? Mine are all rusty and ugly, and need to be replaced sometime soon

[Norcal]

Tom, not sure what will fit inside the stock wheels, but the Brembos will fit in 19s.

[thegunguy]

Didn't Stoptech make a front axle set that fit the OE 18s?

[macfly]

I think AP makes them for stock sizes.

[tomfakes]

The AP ones price out at $8K for a full set. They are already black though - and shipping is free!

[CarlosZ8]

Hi,

My Z8 is currently at the local Brembo dealer, according to them, with the Z8 Alpina wheels and the Big Brake kit, I will need a spacer for the front wheel fitment - about 6mm. Can anyone confirm, or know otherwise? Will a 6mm spacer be an issue?

Thank you in advance.

Carlos

[macfly]

My wheels didn't need a spacer at the front and they are the same dimension and offset as the Alpina rims, so it doesn't sound right, but if he is getting it from the Brembo fitment list I guess they put it there for a reason. You could always ring Race Tech who import Brembo and ask them directly. 714.438.1118


http://www.racetechnologies.com/prod...2003_BMW_Z8E52

[Z8Mania]

My opinion on spacers: if you're not driving on the track they are probably fine. However, it is critical to get a good spacer made by a company that knows the metal involved as different rates of expansion and contraction can cause vibration/ ride (and eventually safety) problems. Also sticking your tires further out will expose the sides of the vehicle to more road debris (they are already fairly far out). You may wish to get the rocker panels covered by a clear protector. Also you'll be expanding the track of the car by 12mm in the front, so I would do the same thing to the rear to make sure the handling is the same. This might also affect alignment.

[CarlosZ8]

Thank you both for the replies. I will inform the board once I have the final answer.

[Z8doc]

Hi,

My Z8 is currently at the local Brembo dealer, according to them, with the Z8 Alpina wheels and the Big Brake kit, I will need a spacer for the front wheel fitment - about 6mm. Can anyone confirm, or know otherwise? Will a 6mm spacer be an issue?

Thank you in advance.

Carlos

I have Beyern 20" rims with the same offset and size (front / rear staggered fitment) as your Alpina Rims and are designed as replacements for the 20" rims and DO NOT require a space with my Big Brake kit and hence, you should not either, assuming that the Big Brake kit you are getting is the same as the ones we all have gotten and they have not changed the dimensions of the calipers or rotors, etc. Do you have the actual part numbers and can compare to the part no.s listed in this thread?

[CarlosZ8]

Update - The parts numbers are correct, the Brembo dealer tells me that the clearance issue is very very small, would really only be a "scraping the paint" issue after they tried a test fitment. This could well be specific to the Alpina wheel design, despite the similar clearance specs to other wheels, or even be production tolerance issues.

We have decided to go with H&R 5mm spacers to resolve the issue, and new longer bolts to ensure safety. The car has yet to be test driven, but there seems to be no clearance issues. Thank you again for the help.

[Z8doc]

Did you look yourself? Just find it strange it 'scrapes' as the interior design of the backside of the Alpina wheel is pretty standard and flat, similar to the Beyern I have and I have about 1 inch clearance at the narrowest point on the fronts and several inches on the rear. Mac and ///MBlitz, how are the front rear clearances with your Motorsport 101s and Norcal, same question with your HREs?

[Norcal]

I'll check, but my HREs could well be much thinner (but no way an inch!)

[macfly]

Clearance is tight for sure, maybe 1/8 inch at the front.

[Z8doc]

I over estimated my front clearance but just enough room for me to barely get my fingers in their but really only 1.5 centimeters (5/8 inch) maximum. Considering 19 inch will usually fit the big brake kit I just do not understand why the 20 inch Alpina does not??? Is it the balancing weights that are scraping?

[Z8doc]

Carlos, Are we talking about the clearance area between the face of the caliper and the backside of the Alpina spokes and hence needed a spacer to push the wheel out away from the caliper face or does adding the space push it out so it does not scrape on the body of the wheel?

[CarlosZ8]

Hi Jeff,

The slight clearance problem is between the face of the caliper - w the "BREMBO" name - and the back face of the Alpina wheel. There is more than enough clearance radially, as you point out. I have been chained to the office so have not seen the installation myself, but the mechanic describes it as being very slight, but there is definitely rubbing at the highest point of the caliper wrt the back face of the wheel, possibly where the paint on the caliper is thickest. We decided it was best to use a thin spacer and longer bolt.

One other question - there is apparently no hook or place to attach the brake sensor cable? The mechanic simply secured it with a tie wrap. This OK?

Thanks again.

[macfly]

apparently no hook or place to attach the brake sensor cable? The mechanic simply secured it with a tie wrap. This OK?

Yes, thats exactly what we did on mine.

[Z8Mania]

Carlos, it seems like you've made the right calls. Good for you. I'd like to see pictures when you're done if you have them and are willing to share. Either way, congratulations!

[Z8doc]

Good job Carlos. We too tied up the brake sensor. Just need to check your pads periodically. Hope to meet you sometime !👍👍

[CarlosZ8]

Thanks all. Will post pics asap. Carlos

[CarlosZ8]

I was finally able to drive the car and get the Brembos properly bedded in. On my car, without the thin spacer, the inner edge of the Alpina spokes and the leading edge of the Brembos make paint to paint contact, hardly noticeable but there. A very thin spacer solved the problem.

The brakes look great on the car, but more importantly stopping power and consistency are improved.

Thanks all for your help.

[Z8Mania]

Thanks for the update Carlos. It looks great. Is it a 5 or 6mm spacer? I don't think that really presents much of an issue so long as its a good quality spacer and the bolts are the correct length.

[Dogsbreath]

Another shot of the Brembos. Cross drilled rotors and spacers. Racing Dynamics rd2 wheels. If you are going to put the car on the track I would not opt for cross drilled rotors. On a short track with lots of braking and little time for cool down the rotors may warp. That being said, likely not an issue for 99% of Z8 owners. And I had my car up at Miller Motorpsorts in Tooele, Utah (big track) with no issues

dave p

[macfly]

For some reason the attachment didn't load up?

[Z8Mania]

Yes I don't see it. Also, any thoughts on the spacers and track driving? I thought its better to not use spacers if you're going on track... no?

[Norcal]

I got the cross drilled rotors when I put brembos on my Z8. They are not likely to warp, but under extreeme track conditions, you will get cracking around the holes. When I replace the rotors on my track car ( Porsche) I will switch to slotted or divitted rotors for that reason.

[Dogsbreath]

Here i am trying again Attachment 8836

I can testify that the cross drilled rotors do warp. I had the car on a very short technical track (Spring Mountain in Pahrump). Its a track better suited to the old mini. No cracking occurred. I am using narrow spacers but ot does put some extra strain on the running gear. That being said, the service guys have over 20 years of experience with BMW. I took it to them to double check everything and they had no concerns

[Z8Mania]

I know Porsche put spacers on many of their cars right out of the factory so I think so long as they are done well they should be OK. The real key is the proper metallurgy. I'm also sure the cross drilled rotors can warp if they are metal. No doubting it. I think its more likely you get cracking but either can happen. One thing's for sure, driving like that is a blast! Btw- the pictures did not attach.

[macfly]

OK, I see what the issue is, we can't use the top menu bar to upload images, we have to do it the old fashioned way until we get a new tech, I fired the last guy!

When you've done writing your post, go to "Go Advanced" down in the bottom right, and use the old upload system from there.

[zed8]

Clearance is tight for sure, maybe 1/8 inch at the front.

Is this the clearance between 20" style 101 wheels and 8 piston brembo calipers? I found this diagram from brembo. The distance between the caliper face and the hat face is 33.5mm for the 8 piston calipers and 34.6mm for the 6 piston calipers. According to your measurement the clearance is approximately 3mm. 6 piston caliper is 1.1 cm closer to the wheel compared to the 8 piston caliper. If this is correct 6 piston calipers won`t let the wheels sit on the disc hat. Is this correct?

www.racetechnologies.com_images_elements_7266DE642FD1B89381D4DCBBEFB0DC79.pdf
www.racetechnologies.com_images_elements_E1D889E71F81F8DC35962B92BE5A4A6A.pdf

[macfly]

The six piston on the rear has ample clearance, but if you are talking about using a different 6 piston on the front then I really can't give you a sure answer. Your measurements, the diagram and your conclusion certainly all appear to say it won't.

[Gammaman]

The AP ones price out at $8K for a full set. They are already black though - and shipping is free!

Checked with AP (and Stillen), no longer producing for the Z8:

Dear Sir

AP Racing UK used to list a front and rear kits for the Z8 to suit the stock 18” rims, with supply of the 1^st kits starting in 2006. But sales were fairly poor on what was a low volume / hand finished BMW model e.g. owners keeping the cars standard here in Europe.
Hence we decided to cease production of the kits back in 2009.
We still list the front and rear calipers and front and rear discs from the kits, but the caliper adaptor brackets and disc mounting bells are no longer a production parts.
It’s possible that our US Distributor still list kits?
STILLEN Brake Division
3176 Airway,
Costa Mesa,
California,
92626
Tel: (+1) 714 755 6688
Fax: (+1) 714 540 1826
Email: [email protected]
Web: http://www.stillen.com

Regards

Peter Collen

[Norcal]

I've lost track... Are you looking to put big brakes in 18" wheels? Or in 19s or 20s? If the latter, brembos is the answer.

[Gammaman]

Would like to upgrade the brakes and keep the stock 18" wheels.

[Gunz#7]

I am upgrading my breaks with Brembo GT but the rear brake shield (black plate) touching the new break discs, while fronts have enough clearance. How did you solve this issue when you upgraded with a bigger discs? Cut the shield or put a spacer? If anyone had same issue and know the solution, can you please give me a tip?

[macfly]

A spacer would work, but I just cut back the shield.

[Gunz#7]

Thank you Andrew. Is this a common issue of the Brembo kit? In my case, the new disc seems to touch with the disc at both outer and inner circle of the shield and I'm afraid I cannot just cut the outer circle of the shield and need to remove the shield. Didn't you have any issue after you cut off the shield?

[macfly]

No, none at all, I seem to remember it was simpler to cut it back that remove it at the time, but it's been a while, so the details are a bit fuzzy now.