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Thread: Fault Codes

  1. #1
    Carter Carter Rise's Avatar
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    Fault Codes

    I couldn't resist and purchased a peake fault code reader, thinking I could figure it out from there with the help of this board and the m5 board. Unfortunately, I have multiple codes - first 08: intake CPS for bank #2 - easy enough, but then i got 71: intake camshaft 2 VANOS position control and b8: intake camshaft 1 VANOS position control. Any ideas on what the last 2 codes mean and what I should do about them? I am tempted just to replace the CPS and see if that clears things up, but wanted to see if anyone else has had these other 2 codes.

    Thanks,
    Carter

  2. #2
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    These are all related CPS faults. It looks like you have issues with the intake sensor on both banks. I'd advise changing all four sensors while you're in there as they generally go around the same time.
    thegunguy

  3. #3
    In addition to these fault codes, is the check engine light on or is the car performing poorly? I am curious if there is an intermittent problem causing the fault codes or if there is an ongoing issue with the cam position sensor(s).
    My Best,

    Ed

    2002 Z8 Jet Black//Sport Red
    2012 SLS AMG Obsidian Black/Classic Red

  4. #4
    Carter Carter Rise's Avatar
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    Performance has clearly lost some performance. Check engine light is on and when I clear the codes, they are back within 10 minutes of driving. I don't think I can classify the problem as intermittant.

    Time to change the 3 remaining sensors and see if that clears up the problem (dealer did exhaust bank #1 in June).

    Sounds like I don't have VANOS issues, then, which is a plus!

  5. #5
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    Well, the Cam Position Sensor is part of the Vanos system, which is why the codes read as such. Vanos ~ cam on the S62. It's a magnet that tells the computer where the each cam is in on its linear path of travel.

    A failed CPS will trip the CEL and shift the effected cam to a static mode. I don't believe that it's harmful to drive the car gently/around town, but the Vanos system will no longer be adjusting the valves to maximize power across the RPM range. So, yes, you should notice a difference, and you should replace the faulty sensor ASAP.

    The CPSs are simply maintenance items like belts, and from our car and the M5, it appears like ~20k is what you can expect on the original sensors. The new replacement sensors are slightly different in size, and I wonder if BMW (or the supplier) made them more robust. When I say they're different in size, they're still proper in use for the car as specified by BMW - they're just "beefier" in appearance. The same part is used in many BMW engines.

    I'd probably add these to anyone doing a 10 year re-fresh. They're going to fail, and they easy enough to change while doing other stuff.
    thegunguy

  6. #6
    Looks like that'll be on my menu for next year then, along with all the hoses etc. Can't believe it's been ten years so soon!! The website here is just a couple of months away from it's 10th b'day too, it may not need a refesh, but I do! :-)
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  7. #7
    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    EML code came up on dash yesterday, throttle limped aqt idle nada power, any suggestions out there guys? Thnx, Jim

  8. #8
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    My general approach:
    Anytime you get a code, shut the car off for a few minutes, and then restart it. If the condition persists, schedule a service appointment. If all is normal and the light resets, drive cautiously (low revs and speed) for a few miles to see if the condition or code return. If it does, stop the car as soon as possible at a safe location, and schedule an appointment. If all continues fine, note the condition and report it at your next service.

    In addition to the above, I'd also read the code ASAP. With the low price and easy availability of code readers and massive info available on codes with even a Google search, I'd suggest anyone with an aging car like the Z8 invest in some sort of OBDII reader. I use an iPhone app and a BT reader. It's been helpful in diagnosing several important and faulty issues.
    thegunguy

  9. #9
    Maybe we should make an iPhone app to read the Peak codes?

    When we were out the other day I reset a CEL on Marty's car with the Peak, but couldn't read the code, or find anywhere online to give a quick take on what the code said. I'd love to be able to just read the fault off right away.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  10. #10
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    There are several in the store already. Mine's not great, but it works. It pairs with a wifi or BT OBD interface.
    thegunguy

  11. #11
    I looked in the App Store under OBD and Code Reader and saw nothing?

    I actually just called Peake, got a PDF, and have already printed it out and put it in the tool kit in the truck ready for the next time!
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  12. #12
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    I just did a search for "OBD" and found at least a dozen. However, only a few look reputable.

    I have Rev, but I wouldn't recommend it - largely because it hasn't been updated since January 2010. Dash Command looks pretty good, and it has been updated recently. It's also a universal version (works on iPhone and iPad). I'm considering purchasing it and ditching Rev.

    These apps will give you the ability to read/reset codes from the computer, but they also can give your data from other onboard sensors like velocity, RPM, temps, fuel flow, etc. They also use the accelerometer to measure G loads, but I'm not sure how accurate the phone accelerometer is for this. If you want to nerd out with an iPad on your dash, you can even setup your own gauges.

    You'll need an OBD interface for the iPhone. I have a Wifi one from PLX, but I got it very early. There are many other options in the sub $100 range now that mostly use bluetooth. You can find them easily on Amazon. I'd recommend the wired GoPoint versus wireless for simplicity.
    thegunguy

  13. #13
    Thats odd, here's what I get - nada!
     
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  14. #14
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    Look in the iTunes App Store, not the Mac App Store. It's for your phone or iPad.

    Their segregation of stores can be confusing, but I think they do it so that people don't mistakenly buy desktop Mac apps for their phone.
    thegunguy

  15. #15
    OK, I see it now, Blue Driver looks good, but all I really want is something read my Peake Codes.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  16. #16
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    For those following along and aren't up on all this. The big advantage to Andrew's Peake reader is that it speaks the BMW proprietary codes. The universal OBDII codes will put you on the right track, but they're generally less specific. To date, I've never run in to an issue where OBD didn't give me enough to go on, but you never know.
    thegunguy

  17. #17
    Team Z8 KenZ8's Avatar
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    The GoPoint/iPhone combination has worked flawlessly on all of my cars, and has given quite specific information for Ford, Ford Diesel, Honda, Mercedes, Lexus, and BMW Z8 & M5. I take it wherever we travel in whatever vehicle we travel in. Its nice to know on the spot if it is safe to proceed. Thankfully it is usually a leaky gas cap seal.
    As a side note, I have used it at least once on every multi-car/multi-day car club trip- someone ( sometimes me) is always throwing a code with a few hundred spirited miles on the menu which can "upset" the ECU with unusual traction sensor feedback.

  18. #18
    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    This is why I love my old "codeless" cars, what a pain in the butt and knowing it's going to end up at my rapist dealer, whatever.
    So, EML code "COULD" be of the following issues:
    gas cap fit, battery, throttle body, DME, VANOS, fuel pump, fuel line, ... list goes on.
    Car is 041 & has 14k miles a/c stored, run every month and I see thru other blogs that this EML crap has existed for years and I'd say designed in.
    and we get thru dethreading tops, soft frames, heavy wheels, performance pkg bars and etc & still worship their "engineering? So, can't even correctly store it w/o another big bill. Heck, even if I know whats wrong, I can't begin to tackle it and I've got a 2,000 sqft equipped shop.
    Sorry for venting guys, but, I'm beginning to agree w/Keith Martin from Sports Car Market, when I told him why he's never posted a positive Z8 article & he replied, "sizzle sells the steak".......................... Burp, I've had better steak.
    JS

  19. #19

  20. #20
    Sounds like you're doing all the right things with maintaining your Z8. For me, I like the way I feel when driving the car, despite knowing there's a radio and rear plastic window replacement in my near future and a tail light that will require the rear bumper removal at some point down the road too. I know it isn't totally logical, but I wouldn't hesitate to recommend the Z8 with the caveat it is an older design with known and for the most part manageable issues.

    Keep us posted on the EML light, so I'll know what to expect when my car displays the same symptoms.
    My Best,

    Ed

    2002 Z8 Jet Black//Sport Red
    2012 SLS AMG Obsidian Black/Classic Red

  21. #21
    So, EML code "COULD" be of the following issues:
    gas cap fit, battery, throttle body, DME, VANOS, fuel pump, fuel line, ... list goes on.
    You could always just buy a code reader and find out exactly what it is, that is the plus side of coded cars.
    http://www.peakeresearch.com/
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  22. #22
    Beyond the Valley of Z8 Madness
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim View Post
    So, can't even correctly store it w/o another big bill. Heck, even if I know whats wrong, I can't begin to tackle it and I've got a 2,000 sqft equipped shop.
    JS
    This unfortunately is the way it is. There is no way I would own a car, made after 1974, that is not under manufacturer warranty, for exactly that reason.

    The Z8 is an exception to that rule. Don't really consider it a car, it's more like art (with 4 wheels and an engine)
    2003 Z8 Black/Red

  23. #23
    Team Z8 KenZ8's Avatar
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    Owning a car like the Z8 is just like the relationship that you have with the person that you have chosen to spend your life with. There are always things that you have to overlook as nothing/no one is perfect. As long as the good times outweigh the bad, that's just the way life is. When the bad outweighs the good, then its time to move on. It sounds to me like you need to move on.
    As an aside, my nine years of Z8 ownership have brought so much pleasure and introduced me to such great people and places that I cannot even remember the repairs that might have been needed over those years.

  24. #24
    Also it really is a car to drive more than store, and it seems to respond pretty well to getting a certain amount of enthusiastic use.

    I've driven lots of cars, and just can't think of a better way of crossing the beautiful western states than in a Z8, but of course all the pictures here show that, and as for Kieth Martin, we'll I've seen him pontificating a lot, but I've never seen him drive once.

    I love driving, he just cares about money, no doubt his idea of heaven is pontificating on value of a golf green, while mine is flying along the open the roads of the American West in the most wonderfully beautiful modern roadster I can think of.

    If you don't get to enjoy the Z8 in its natural habitat I can see you're just living with all the downsides, and none of the pleasures. If I lived in Florida I'd be more likely to have boats than cars as it isn't really a drivers paradise.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  25. #25
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    I don't think I could have said it better, Ken. Compared to its contemporaries, the Z8 is practically problem free and affordable to maintain, but like relationships or anything in life, it's not perfect. To enjoy it for a lifetime, it will require some work.

    For my "aside", I have no issue maintaining modern computer controlled cars. I started my automotive "adulthood" rebuilding my first car, a 1964 Mercury Comet (the Falcon clone), among many other "classics". I've found newer cars to be as easy to maintain in your own garage. In some ways newer cars are vastly easier. Anyone that's had to sync carbs knows what I'm talking about. Yes, they require investment in some diagnostic equipment, with a code reader on the front line and PC based tools on deeper tiers, but these tools are easily attainable at reasonable prices. The tradeoff is that you get a pretty good idea of faults instead of having to chase down issues with guess work and experience. With either classic or new cars, when stuff gets beyond my ability, I turn to the great support relationships that I've built, like Dana and Matt at Peter Pan.

    I've even been at the track where guys had their Lotus plugged in to a laptop adjusting settings between sessions when right next to them some guy's adjusting the timing on his 66 Mustang with an analog light. Same stuff, different era.
    thegunguy

  26. #26
    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    Hey Guys, I really appreciate the comments and please don't misunderstand me, I love my Z8 & it along w my other toys are a pride and joy (much like my wife, Ken) and I love em all but this "code" frustration level is exasperating at times.
    Btw, are then any code readers out yet for our womens?
    Now that would be a heck of an iphone app.
    Thnx again, I'll let the board now the code verdict when I can get to it.
    Happy New Year to all,
    Jim
    041

  27. #27
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    I'm going to guess CPS based on age and mileage.
    thegunguy

  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by jim View Post
    Btw, are then any code readers out yet for our womens?
    Now that would be a heck of an iphone app.
    Thnx again, I'll let the board now the code verdict when I can get to it.
    Happy New Year to all,
    Jim
    041
    In that same spirit, here's Andy Rooney's take on women over 40...

    http://www.divinecaroline.com/22323/...y-rooney-forty
    My Best,

    Ed

    2002 Z8 Jet Black//Sport Red
    2012 SLS AMG Obsidian Black/Classic Red

  29. #29
    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    If anyone recalls the EML dash light came on my 14k mile 2000 car went into "limp" mode. Btw, the car has always run flawlessly.
    I did have a friend w a Peake code reader come by and it said, : misfire on cyl's 4&7 & ign coil #3 cyl. So, we were thinking (as the car is basically stored) that we had a throttle body issue as this & M5 blog has offered. Nothing about any cam sensor's.
    Finally was able to get my Z8 flat bedded to my dealer who just called and said I need a new DME for $2400! I'm heading up later today for a tech face to face. I'm concerned now that once this is installed it will then point to the problem then more $$$.
    Any comments out there?
    jim
    0041

  30. #30
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    What were the actual codes?
    thegunguy

  31. #31
    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    What were the actual codes?

    Codes were:18, 96, d0, d3, d5

    I just returned from dealer meeting whereby tech's first question to me was, "has this car recently been jump started w/cables?". I replied, "never".
    He plugged in and got 14 code faults, cleared them and got only one, "DME out". So, he's thinking somehow the main motor processor (DME) has been baked or surged in some fashion. Which is amazing as this car last ran perfectly and only has a new Deltran 12v trickle charger attached.
    Anyway, as your aware I'm not into codes, so, (tonque in cheek) I told him to rip all of it (computer crap) out as the motor runs great and we go from there.
    Any ideas guys?
    Thanks,
    Jim
    0041

  32. #32
    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    Hi Guys,
    EML Light.
    Conclusion to my Feb 21st blog entry (above). Just picked up my beloved Z8. Code readings that I took w/serious BMW guy w/Peake reader had nothing in common w/my "dealer's" reading. Braman of West Palm told me I needed an entire new DME & air bag control units. Cost $3,400. including 7.3 hrs "labor @ $170/hr. I spke w/ technician who told me he had to remove the console to get to air bag module 4 hrs & it takes 3.3 hrs to install and program a DME... and they wouldn't give me my core back for either! Are you serious? Guys this car is a stored car (ac/warehouse) and is run twice a month for maybe 50 miles. It has a Battery Tender connected at all times. I've owned over a hundred cars and currently own 9 classics, this isn't my first rodeo.
    So, straightout, modular units are great to tell us or techs exactly whats wrong and can be easily swapped for convienance?...I think not. This is why I don't trust dealers.
    It's so sad how engineers can design and build such a beautiful automobile whereby the customer is at the will of the greedy dealer. I will NEVER be back to BRAMAN, done finished goodby.
    Jim

  33. #33
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    Having a knowledgable and trustworthy service group is so key for cars like the Z8. It seems like there is a history of poor service in the SE of the US.

    Your friend's code diagnosis matches mine, misfires, which could be caused by numerous issues, including all the typical sensor bits. With the age and mileage of your car, you might start with replacing these (MAF, CPS, O2, etc.). They're likely near needing replacement, if not already. So, you can start with this as sunk cost anyway as at 12 years, it's time, and it will give you a clean slate to diagnose from.

    I will throw out some caution on the Deltran (the OE supplier of the BMW charger) tenders. I don't trust them. Their surge circuitry is weak. My original one actually melted the points from arcing when inserting it one time, and I know of others that have had the same experience with this model on other cars, bikes, etc. A little Google investigation will show this is not unheard of. I'm not sure what sort of surge protection the itself computer has, but I wouldn't put it past the Detran frying it. It's a very, very, cheaply made charger that was probably added to the Z8 as an afterthought just before it was released. They sell for $65 retail (more with a BMW label) in today's dollars...not exactly the quality piece of electronics you want maintaining and protecting a car of this worth.

    I've switched to an Accumate Pro, with a hard connection to the battery. If you store your vehicle, I'd highly recommend this over the dinky Deltran from BMW.
    thegunguy

  34. #34
    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    Good info, thank you. I was wondering about if it could have been a Battery Tender issue and will call them soon to discuss. Surge protection comes to mind automatically when it comes to anything w/control units but I have no problems w any other vehicles all stored in same local.
    Thnx, good info will advise.
    Jim

  35. #35
    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    Re Accumate Pro, which one, 4amp, 6amp they even have a 24v??
    Thnx,
    Jim