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Thread: State of the market update....

  1. #1

    State of the market update....

    I just had a quick look over at Autotrader to check how the Z8 market is doing. Since most of us don't plan on selling it isn't of that much importance, but it is always good to have a reasonable idea of the value of one's assets. This is the scoop for this month;

    $159,995 Highest price
    $83,900 Lowest price
    $103,926 Average price

    We have a car that is behaving completely differently to any other car that was sold in this market segment at this time. Check out all the cars that the Z8 was roadtested against, and you'll see they have suffered over a 55% depreciation, as opposed to our cars average of just 18%.

    Once we have the frame fix in place, and BMW have shown both us and the world that they really are an honorable company who stand behind their prodcuts, we may even start seeing cars with the Performance Package, LSD and all the correct upgrades start to climb in value. The market has spoken, this is a car that is already standing the test of time very well. See you at Pebble Beach in 2020!
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  2. #2
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    Andrew,

    You are correct. Your implication about not having anything really to do with money is right one. The car continues to evolve and find its place. The frame issue will be resolved and become a non-issue. Your survey is consistent with what Fisker and others hoped for. He had great things to say at the Pasadena show and so I think this is about a very special project that transended the limited production marketing concept. This was about much more.

    ________________

    Bob Adler

  3. #3

    How was the event?

    I was sorry not to get to go, was it a good show?
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  4. #4
    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    Regarding market conditions for the Z8's, I follow a batch of markets for numerous cars (Ebay, Monkey, Hemmings, Sports Car Market to name a few) and have definately noticed an increase of Z8 supply coming to market. For instance, Ebay was averaging 4-7 for sale at any one time up thru June 06. Now there seem to be 8-12 for sale at any one time. I've also noticed a slight softening in prices. From an approx avg of $95g's to $85g's. I can only assume the frame issue is playing a part in this and therefore highly recommend anyone buying the Ultimate Deutche Sled (das Z8) gets it to a dealer who can inspect the towers etal before purchasing.
    I also recomend BMW,NA gets the fix out soon or at least a press release on what the Performence Pkg is going to look like with details.
    As a "Club" we can speak with one voice to relevant issues and conduct ourselves accordingly w/much better chances of mutual satisfaction to our questions from BMW. BTW, as a Florida resident I would be all for a North American club, (not just U.S.) as the more, the merrier, not to mention effective. FYI, SAAC (Shelby Club) is international as are many others.
    Anyone going to Pebble Beach later this month (8/18-22) for Concours de Elegance? Maybe we can meet and organize.

  5. #5
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    The Pasadena show was okay. Nothing unusual. Fisker was very nice, signed my Book, and talked about his design. I didn't see any other Z8's there.

  6. #6
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    While you could certainly argue that the frame issue is causing an increase of Z8s on the market (several here have "cashed in"), I'm not certain that this is the sole reason. I have talked to several owners that do not participate "online" and they were unaware of the issue, even with BMW's last letter, and almost no dealer in my area has much of an idea of the issue.

    I believe there are other reasons that are contributing to the increase in the number of cars available:
    1. Seasonality - this is the prime time of year to buy/sell a convertible. So, the market should "heat up".
    2. Warranty Expiration - the last of the cars are beginning to lose their factory coverage.
    3. Leases Expiring - the last of any leased cars will be coming to term.
    4. Owner Profile Shift - I "theorized" in some thread recently that the number owners that bought the car because it was the latest high-profile BMW/"it-car" (not a collector or enthusiast) should be decreasing rapidly, leaving us with an owner group primarily mad up of collectors and enthusiasts.
    5. Queuing Statistics - if you want to get really technical we can discuss the impact of queues, servers, and Poisson tables (requires beer for proper analysis ).

    As of the end of August, I will have had my car a year, and I watched the market for about two years prior to my purchase. From my experience, there doesn't seem to be any more listings on eBay this summer, and AutoTrader seems to have fewer (2 pages versus 3). I do agree that prices seem to have fallen a bit from last year. However, this only seems to be the case with private parties and smaller dealers.

    At this point, it's difficult to assess the "damage" of the knowledge of the frame issue. I could certainly be hastening the declining value of our cars, but it just seems that there are only a handfull of us that are aware of the issue. Also, since BMW's fix/upgrade is still roughly on schedule to be released, this may become a non-issue - we hope.

    On the Club, I think everyone is in agreement of conducting the club as a North American club (working with BMW NA), while the Club in Germany will serve as the global group acting as a representative with BMW AG.
    thegunguy

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    Sport Button On - DSC Off jim's Avatar
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    I agree & well stated Rifle, good points. Markets are made up of many varibles & ingredients. There were approx 1,700 Z8's exported to North America, and we have a small proxy of what, 100 cars? Statistically speaking that's a weak rep. However, I can uneqivocably state that mine (0041 car) is/will not be for sale. In fact I've bid recently on others as the market has softened, and intend to continue to do so.

  8. #8
    DSC Off Orcatek's Avatar
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    Funny when I found my car 15 months ago, I was tracking 38 cars that were on the market at that time. The number didn't seem to move much up or down by more than 4-5 cars during any week.

    I was searching a lot of sources and tracking by VIN numbers. Alot of Ebay cars are dealers, so they continue to repost the car. Often with gaps between listing if they think they have a buyer on the line.

    I was tracking Ebay, Autotrader, Cars.com, BMW CPO, Dupont Registry to name a few.

  9. #9

    I wonder if the new 'Z8' will imact values?

    My biggest concern is that be introducing a new cheaper SL fighting Z8 BMW will do more to destroy the value of our cars than anything. I am really hoping they will call it a Z6, Z7, Z9, Z10.

    I think it is a real slap in the face to all the serious collectors who bought this car believing BMW when they said it was to be a unique limited edition special, and that there wouldn't be another Z8. Ahhh well, I guess honor is in as short supply at BMW as strong aluminum.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  10. #10
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    More than just a name...

    I don't think the new ZX (6, 8, 10, whatever) will cast its shadow over our cars. Sure, the automotive press will compare the two, and the those seeking the latest and greatest automotive fashion appliance will be drawn to the new car, but they're almost uncomparable. I believe this due to two primary reasons.

    1. Our cars are hand-built in limited numbers - the new car will be mass-produced on an assembly line.
    2. Our cars are a masterful update on classic styling, design, and proportion - the new car will reflect the current BMW design themes.

    I hesitate using the example, but it's kind of like the new TT. Yeah, it's probably better, but history will remember the revolutionary design of the original car. Or, look at the Shelbys (both Cobras and Mustangs). The original 289 powered versions were ground-breaking performers for their era. As such, these original cars, are generally held in higher regard, and value, when compared to their heavier big-block successors.

    I predict the new car will be a fabulous car in it's own element, but after a few years, the glamour will fade and it will disappear into the background. I could be wrong, but it just doesn't seem to have long-term charisma. The E52 Z8 was, is, and will always be something special - a classic. For most of us, no new car will never take that away.
    thegunguy