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Thread: 2000 Z8 (#60019) Silver/Red - Sold

  1. #1
    Z8Mania
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    2000 Z8 (#60019) Silver/Red - Sold

    Someone is selling one of the DE cars...

    http://www.heritageclassics.com/inve...-roadster.html

    Car #19 and asking a pretty penny too.
     

  2. #2
    That was the second car down the production line when they moved it from the M Division in Munich out to Dingolfin, and also the car I drove on my first day at the DE!

    Not only that, but this is the same shop in LA that I bought my first Z8 from, because the owner, who is French, imported a dozen or so grey market cars from France.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  3. #3
    Z8 Guru 2112's Avatar
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    Price seems steep for a DE car, especially considering the lack of the Perf. Package.
    .
    2000 Red over black
    heavily modified for performance. Although, not to the level of GM's car

  4. #4
    Yes, I'd agree in one way, but as time passes I'm starting to think that the DE cars have their own provenance that could actually cancel out the consequence of their early abuse. This is still a very low mileage car, I think most of the DE car were sold with 12-15k miles on the clock, so this one has been little used and well pampered since being in private hands.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  5. #5
    Z8 Ate My Homework! Norcal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by macfly View Post
    Yes, I'd agree in one way, but as time passes I'm starting to think that the DE cars have their own provenance that could actually cancel out the consequence of their early abuse. This is still a very low mileage car, I think most of the DE car were sold with 12-15k miles on the clock, so this one has been little used and well pampered since being in private hands.
    Yes, but we know YOU drove it!

  6. #6
    Personally, I think this is just wrong, unethical and deceitful (I ran out of ways to say the samething) and everything that's wrong with used car salespeople. The seller should disclose that this was a DE car that was abused, not "IMMACULATE 2 OWNER CALIFORNIA CAR." I imagine (hope) that the DE folks maintained the cars well, but the wear and tear on this car is well beyond the 19K miles on the clock.
    C.A. Cardenas (AKA Dan)
    2003 (last one?) Z8 - Hellrot / Sport Rot
    Original Owner - Munich Tourist Delivery
    -- Others --
    1988 M6 - 32K mi. - Original Owner
    1989 DINAN 750iL - 73K mi. - Original Owner
    1998 M3 - 63K mi. - Original Owner
    2015 X5 (F15) Diesel - Daily Driver

  7. #7
    Since these cars were sold by BMW NA at auction as ex-fleet cars I really lay the blame for this with BMW NA. It is very possible that the two buyers and Heritage (who are most likely selling it on consignment) really have no idea what these cars were put through.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  8. #8
    During my Z8 search I was a frequent visitor of this site that eventually enabled me to find my well maintained, single owner car. I hope that anyone considering purchasing 00019 will have knowledge of this site, so they are positioned to make an informed decision.

    FWIW, on a DE car I would insist on it passing a four wheel alignment inspection to ensure the enthusiastic driving of the past didn't tweak the frame to the point that the suspension cannot be set to within BMW's specifications.
    My Best,

    Ed

    2002 Z8 Jet Black//Sport Red
    2012 SLS AMG Obsidian Black/Classic Red

  9. #9
    Z8 Millennial Monster hayvenhurstkid's Avatar
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    Personally I wouldn't touch this car with a ten foot pole. It's worse than a rental car that comes up for sale. This was abused for up to 15,000 miles by who knows how many drivers. It should, like a house you are selling, be subject to full disclosure.
    Marty

    2001 Z8
    2014 Range Rover sport Autobiography
    2013 Ford Raptor
    2011 Porsche 911 turbo S coupe

  10. #10
    Agreed, but sadly the lack of disclosure started with BMW NA.

    I think of the DE cars more like race cars, in that they've been run at their maximum since new, and they are what they are. I still think that they have an interesting and unique provenance that in the fullness of time will add to their historic appeal.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  11. #11
    Z8 Millennial Monster hayvenhurstkid's Avatar
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    However, race cars are driven by professional drivers. These were put into the hands of many novices who ended up all over the place, including the muddy inside of the track. JMHO.
    Marty

    2001 Z8
    2014 Range Rover sport Autobiography
    2013 Ford Raptor
    2011 Porsche 911 turbo S coupe

  12. #12
    It just occured to me that someone reading this may have no idea what we're talking about, so for the benefit of the uninitiated, here is my report on the Z8 DE where this car spent it's first four years being thrashed into a pulp.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  13. #13
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    I totally agree with all your comments. This one is shame on BMW NA for letting these cars out into the fleet. They could have been kept as museum pieces or used for instruction with their body shops or whatever but they should not have been for sale.

    On the flip side while they were driven hard/ possibly abused/ I believe the folks at the DE replaced things like brakes, clutch, tires all the time so unless it was in an accident these cars did get an extreme dose of servicing (out of necessity). The place I'd be very concerned is the motor. I read a story in one of the BMW enthusiast rags I get about raising the rev limiter even just a few hundred RPM and the magazine tech editor responded that in his opinion its not the greatest idea for the long term because the wear and tear on a motor does not occur linearly, but rather exponentially- so those extra 500 RPM after say 7000 RPM or whatever could make a much larger difference than it seems to us. This makes sense to me and while I routinely "rev out" the motor, I usually shift several hundred RPM before the red line/ rev limiter.

    I think a place like this one should know the history of the car and **IF** they know, then shame on them too. But this car shouldnt even be out there in the fleet.

    I think he might get close to his asking though because the market for these seems pretty darn strong.

  14. #14
    Z8 Guru 2112's Avatar
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    Piping in again;

    I don't see anything wrong with selling the car, with full disclosure and therefore to 99% of all buyers, a much lower price than a comparable 19K, 2 owner car.
    .
    2000 Red over black
    heavily modified for performance. Although, not to the level of GM's car

  15. #15
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    I agree with you. Your way is honest. This dealer is just being, well, a dealer.

  16. #16
    Team Z8 JoshB's Avatar
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    I wonder is there anything different about these cars from the regular production run other than the early vanos and top issues?
    2002 Silver Black/Red

    Dinan stage 4 software
    Dinan low restriction carbon fiber airboxes
    Dinan high flow air mass meters
    Hamann headers
    Supersprint exhaust
    performance package
    custom short shift linkage
    cdv modifacation
    Quaiffe differential/military grade gear polishing
    19 inch 3 piece HRE mags/Toyo tires
    Custom crossdrilled/slotted rotors
    ceramic brake pads
    stainless brake lines
    Dinan caster plates
    Dinan duel mass flywheel
    custom Sachs clutch /pressure plate
    Dinan pedal set

  17. #17
    Z8Mania
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    Maybe the fact that the good folks at the Driving Experience constantly reminded us "NYC"- "not your car". Implying you can drive it like, well, like its not your car!

  18. #18
    Team Z8 Charles's Avatar
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    Are any of you SoCal or first owner guys contacting the dealer to tell them what they have so they don't get sued later?
    Charles Guerin
    AH61406 - Titanium Silver/ /Black

  19. #19
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
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    I'm sure the cars are fine, but the lack of disclosure isn't.

    These cars illustrate a flaw in the registration system.
    thegunguy

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Z8Mania View Post
    "NYC"- "not your car".
    My most vivid memory of the DE is the huge smile on my oldest son's face (teen at the time) while sitting in one of the cars in a small ditch. He later said, "Dad, it's not our car."
    C.A. Cardenas (AKA Dan)
    2003 (last one?) Z8 - Hellrot / Sport Rot
    Original Owner - Munich Tourist Delivery
    -- Others --
    1988 M6 - 32K mi. - Original Owner
    1989 DINAN 750iL - 73K mi. - Original Owner
    1998 M3 - 63K mi. - Original Owner
    2015 X5 (F15) Diesel - Daily Driver

  21. #21
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    Thats funny.