Results 1 to 32 of 32

Thread: Michelin Pilot Sport Info for 2011

  1. #1
    Z8Mania
    Guest

    Michelin Pilot Sport Info for 2011

    Im not sure if the names here are relevant to the whole world or just the UK (I suspect the world); but I saw this in the latest edition of the UK market "Car" magazine and I thought you all would be interested in seeing this. It seems they are dropping the PS2 name in favor of simply PS and the PS3 is indeed more of an all season tire and now they have the PS Super Sport... interesting....
     

  2. #2
    The odd thing is that the Pilot Super Sport actually looks very like the old Pilot Sport Cup's I used to use on the GT3, while the look of the new Pilot Sport Cup+ is totally unfamiliar to me.

    I'm guessing the ones we'll want will be the Pilot Super Sports, but I hope they are more street friendly than the old MPSC's which only worked when hot, and only had about 20-25 heat cycles in their design life. I used to burn through a full set every four track days, or around every 1500 miles.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  3. #3
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    Im hoping the same thing. Or you could just buy the slicks and avoid wet weather.

  4. #4
    Team Z8 zilver8's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    351
    I've been thinking about replacing the tires on my 2003 Alpina. The car came with Michelin Pilot Sport tires and they now have 12K miles. The tires have lots of thread left but are now 9 years old and I don't want to risk any safety issues. I'm very pleased with the Pilot Sports - ride, handling, noise are great.

    According to Michelin, the new Pilot Super Sports will be available mid-April and are expected to be priced close to the Pilot Sport.

    Should I wait for the Pilot Super Sports or stick with the Pilot Sport? My car is mainly a weekend driver, not driven in rain or snow.

  5. #5
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    Given the more touring character of our cars, I would stay with the regular PS; but the super sport could be fun too- just know you're getting something in between a dedicated track tire and a street tire- thats likely to mean you will get lots of grip for launching, braking, cornering, and perhaps better steering feel also. The downside is if it happens to rain out, I would be very careful when going over 50MPH (it will really depend). These tires seem to be Michelins answer to Pirelli's "corsa" tires- and those can be tricky over 60. I picked 50 to be safe but it could be 60, or it could be 40.

  6. #6
    Z8 Novice
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    4
    Does anyone have an opinion on Michelin PS2's in the runflat v non-runflat configurations? I understand that the new runflats that have been out for approximately 8 months are very similar in feel to the non-runflats. Thanks for any experience, as I am replacing my tires and the runflats are being recommended to me.

  7. #7
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,704
    I've heard the PS2 ZP (the RFT) is really quite good, but comments are always followed by the phrase: "for a run-flat tire". It's still a heavier and harsher tire than the standard version. With the Z8's potential for frame issues, heavy and stiff are things you want to avoid.

    The successor to the PS2 the 'Pilot Sport' should be making its way to market by now, but sizing, as always, will be limited.
    thegunguy

  8. #8
    Z8 Novice
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    4
    Thanks for the feedback.

  9. #9
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    I completely agree with Rifle's take and would just add one thing. If you are driving through areas you'd rather have the peace of mind the RFTs give then you should make sure to get the performance package installed. I'd also note that RFTs are not a miracle product and can suffer damage enough from one pothole that you'd be stuck no different than with a regular tire.

  10. #10
    Canadian eh... zeta's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    33
    I certainly agree with that. I hit the edge of a rock in a Z4 with run-flats and it manged to bend the rim without damaging the tire, but the run-flats were useless in that situation. Maybe a freak, but it happened...
    61339 Silver/Black
    Robin Ensom

  11. #11
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,704
    The other bit of caution on RFTs is that you have to very diligent with monitoring their pressure. While it's best to regularly check pressure with a good gauge, RFTs have little visual indication if you should pick up a nail etc. So, even if you checked at the beginning of nice Saturday drive, you could easily pick up a nail in the driveway and then spend the whole day on the backroads on an unsafe tire that could lead to catastrophic failure. With a standard tire, you could at least feel the change or notice it on a walk-around while filling with fuel. With the RFT, you're basically running on a time-bomb waiting for the sideway to fail.

    Also, I've read too many cases of RFTs having interior separation and chunking (including my original RE040s with only 5k miles) with no external warning. I'm hoping that they've improved on that flaw in newer designs.

    While I think RFTs have their place, I don't like the way manufacturers promote them as a buy and forget solution that will never leave in trouble.
    thegunguy

  12. #12
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    Agreed. The simple fact of the matter is: you're dealing with a complex heavy machine- you should never "buy and forget".

  13. #13
    Z8 Ate My Homework! Norcal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    2,474

    Safety in numbers

    That's why I like "the buddy system" when getting way off the beaten path. The Z8 herd can always rescue a stray!

  14. #14
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    Especially if its a Porsche!

  15. #15
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,704
    Marty's been looking at these to replace a tire on the incoming Alpina. In our discussions, I came up with the following as what I believe the product tree is in the Pilot Sport line. Does this make sense/seem accurate?


    PS3 (formerly Pilot Sport) < Pilot Sport (formerly PS2) < Pilot Super Sport < Pilot Sport Cup+
    thegunguy

  16. #16
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    I dont quite agree. My understanding is as follows.

    PS2 have been broken into two groups: Pilot Sport and Pilot Super Sport. I think the PS gets you PS2 levels and is a bit more for every day but very sporty while the PSS is closer to a track tire but still has road use depth for wet weather.

    PS3 are really formerly Pilot All Season

    Then you have the Cup + which is just the Cup tire improved.

    I believe the PSS will fit the Alpina wheels. If you guys drive your cars primarily in nice weather Id go for that.

  17. #17
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,704
    That's about what I was understanding as well - probably not reflected in my simplified diagram. Basically, as you move to the right, you become more performance focused and less capable of dealing with wet stuff.
    thegunguy

  18. #18
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    Im really curious to try out those MPSS.

  19. #19
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,704
    It seems to be the Alpina tire of choice right now. Old Baillie had them on our Cambria trip, but I didn't get a chance look at them. They look very "tracky" (read sticky but low life) in photos, but they're said to actually last longer than the PS2.
    thegunguy

  20. #20
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    I like "tracky" and for a car that Im not driving every day I'll take lower life and more fun, but even on a daily car, Id make that trade because thats just me. Besides with the roads around here I go through 2-4 tires on my daily Alpina B7 every year. In the past 2 months Ive replaced both front tires. I actually keep a full set of 4 tires in my garage because they are sometimes hard to get and I like being able to show up at my shop with a tire in the trunk and have them change it for me.

  21. #21
    Z8 Millennial Monster hayvenhurstkid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    1,113
    I just ordered a set of new Pilot Super Sports from Flip's Wesco Tire, who is also my tire store of choice. It is the tire my guy there recommended.
    Marty

    2001 Z8
    2014 Range Rover sport Autobiography
    2013 Ford Raptor
    2011 Porsche 911 turbo S coupe

  22. #22
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    Fantastic.

  23. #23
    Team Z8 ZMates's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    393
    Any word on operating temp for these? I hate to be preachy, but a lot of people think track tires are softer than street tires, but it's just the opposite. Track tires are harder and meant to be operated at a higher temperature. You really need to abuse them to get them up to a high enough temperature where they do become sticky. Unless you're at the track you're better off with street tires.
    Silver/black
    Dinan S2 package: headers, throttle bodies, oversized MAFs, airfilters, anti-roll bars, lightweight flywheel
    Dinan by Brembo brake kit and monoball control arm bushings
    BBS forged individual wheels
    Quaife differential, 3.64:1 final drive
    Meisterschaft GT titanium mufflers
    K&W 3 way adjustable competition monotube dampers and monoball adjustable mounts
    CDV delete

  24. #24
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,704
    While I can't speak to the temps specifically, they're very much a street tire that is trackable. The Cups are the ones that are basically slicks with slight treads, and from my experience, they can be a little slippy until warm.

    The SSP should be fine for anyone on the road, but they do seem to back down on wet traction, something the PS2 was known for.
    thegunguy

  25. #25
    Team Z8 ZMates's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    393
    Quote Originally Posted by thegunguy View Post
    While I can't speak to the temps specifically, they're very much a street tire that is trackable.
    From that description, it sounds like they are probably harder than the PS2s. So I would guess that unless you're going to take them to the track and abuse them, you're better off with the PS2s. But without knowing the target operating temp, it's hard to say.
    Silver/black
    Dinan S2 package: headers, throttle bodies, oversized MAFs, airfilters, anti-roll bars, lightweight flywheel
    Dinan by Brembo brake kit and monoball control arm bushings
    BBS forged individual wheels
    Quaife differential, 3.64:1 final drive
    Meisterschaft GT titanium mufflers
    K&W 3 way adjustable competition monotube dampers and monoball adjustable mounts
    CDV delete

  26. #26
    Administrator thegunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,704
    Not at all. I'd describe the PS2 the same, a street tire that is trackable. The problem is that the PS2 is being discontinued across the line, and many sizes are no longer available. On the 20" Alpina, they're gone. They still have them in my 19" size, but stock reads low.

    Of course, they're both rated A on temp, but I'm sure there's a full spec out there somewhere.

    From my research, the new PSS is the successor to the PS2 but with a few differences. It uses some new rubber that is longer wearing but at the same time has greater grip. I'd be curious how progressive the grip is with this new compound. The PS2 was beautifully progressive at the track with so much warning and communication. The PSS's grip+longlife combo may be in part due to the new tread design, which is likely why they're less capable in the wet than the PS2.

    It's always good to proceed with caution, but I don't see the PSS being an issue to most anyone on this board, except for perhaps in the wet.
    thegunguy

  27. #27
    Team Z8 ZMates's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    393
    "From my research, the new PSS is the successor to the PS2 but with a few differences."

    ahh, OK. I'm really confused by naming conventions. I'll stay out of the which PS tire is best discussion since I know pretty much nothing about the new tires. The basic point I wanted to make was: don't think track oriented means stickier, but shorter lasting than street sport tires. It's usually the opposite.
    Silver/black
    Dinan S2 package: headers, throttle bodies, oversized MAFs, airfilters, anti-roll bars, lightweight flywheel
    Dinan by Brembo brake kit and monoball control arm bushings
    BBS forged individual wheels
    Quaife differential, 3.64:1 final drive
    Meisterschaft GT titanium mufflers
    K&W 3 way adjustable competition monotube dampers and monoball adjustable mounts
    CDV delete

  28. #28
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    I agree with Rifle. I dont think the PSS is a problem for street use. I drove a Ferrari 599 GTO, a friends car, right out of a parking lot on cold tires on a 75F day and the tires were fine right from the get go. Reading Michelins language the first time they mention track is on the cup tires. These PSS are really street tires and seems to me they are the highest performance street oriented tires. As such, yes they will be like all summer tires- dont drive them below 45F (or dont expect much grip at least)- dont expect long life- dont drive fast in the wet. You know what- if you dont understand these things then you shouldnt have one of these cars anyway. JMHO.

  29. #29
    :-)) Indeed, though the bit about the cold always gets me. I had a monumental slide a couple of months ago on a very chilly LA morning driving up the north side of Topanga. I figured I'd hit some deisel oil on the road, but it was only a couple of degree above freezing. Suprisingly desert mountain mornings are VERY COLD in LA, it isn't uncommon in the early spring to leave home at 58?, see 65? on the way to the hills, then see it fall to freezing and even below all on the way to breakfast so that might well explain it. Seems even if the Pirellis had some heat in them they don't like cold pavement.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  30. #30
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    If its ever cold and you try to floor it and you get a lot of vibrations from the rear end from lack of traction, gently back off it. I've been advised while this might be fun to do, basically spin cold hard doughnuts, the oscillations in the system can do serious damage to the rear attach points of the drivetrain.

  31. #31
    Z8 Millennial Monster hayvenhurstkid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    1,113
    I am very impressed with the new Michelin Pilot Super Sports. They have an amazing ride and are very sticky in the corners. While no race driver I have driven many different cars with all sorts of different tires. For my taste these tires are a perfect blend between both normal and spirited driving.
    Marty

    2001 Z8
    2014 Range Rover sport Autobiography
    2013 Ford Raptor
    2011 Porsche 911 turbo S coupe

  32. #32
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    Great information. Thanks!