Results 1 to 23 of 23

Thread: What to do if your local dealer advises AGAINST PP upgrade?

  1. #1
    Sport Button On Cytoboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    36

    What to do if your local dealer advises AGAINST PP upgrade?

    I recently purchased my 01 #60650 with around 5K miles, and drive it daily. Of course I was aware of the frame / shock tower issues prior to buying the car, and found no evidence of panel misalignment or shock tower bolt misalignment before I purchased the car. My PS2's are on order, to replace the original Bridgestone RFT's.

    The shop foreman at my local Clear Lake Houston dealer is a Z8 fanatic, and was the foreman when the Z8 originally launched. I also just discovered that HE is the source of the training manual that I received with the car, as he personally attended the Z8 technician's course prior to Z8 introduction in NA. It turns out that my car was the one that propelled his wedding retreat!!

    Now for the issue..........he strongly discourages the PP upgrade. Honestly, I did not pin him down for an answer, but when I visit the dealership, I plan to "talk shop" for awhile.

    So.....what should I do? Listen to him or find a new service location? Please recall that I believe he is probably better informed than any of the shop foremen in our area, and he has tremendous experience with the marque, with a particular passion for the Z8.

  2. #2
    I'm not one to argue with people, so I'd be inclined to take it to another dealership, one that has experience with PP's.

    I certainly wouldn't be prepared to take the risk myself. What if you have the misfortune to whack a bad pothole on a dark night, and you find your perfect car is no longer perfect - how will you feel? Will he or his dealership cover the consequence of his judgement call? For someone who works at a BMW dealer to tell you to leave yourself unguarded against a known issue when a fix exists is totally irresponsible IMHO, regardless of his history with the car.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  3. #3
    in Coral Gables, Florida DirkZ8's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    316
    Quote Originally Posted by Cytoboy View Post
    So.....what should I do?
    Please let him make his case and then post his arguments on this forum for further discussion. I haven't heard anyone make a case against the PP and am curious to hear what he has to say. (I have it installed on my car.)
    Dirk

    Alpina #142
    www.bmwccca.com

  4. #4
    Sport Button On
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    30
    I too recently purchased a 2001 #60707 with 13K miles. It is scheduled to have a complete service with Momentum BMW in Houston, Texas. I spoke with the service manager and he too discouraged the PP. If you find a dealer that has experience installing the PP please let me know. The way I look at it is that it is just an insurance policy. About $1200 to protect a priceless investment - no brainer!

  5. #5
    Z8 Ate My Homework! Norcal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    2,474
    Fact, the risk IS real. The fix could cost upwards of $80,000. You do the math. It's not his 100+000 car, is it? He probably drives a clapped out Chevy.

    Install the PP (IMO)

    That being said, I would like to hear their reasoning.

  6. #6
    Z8 Millennial Monster hayvenhurstkid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    1,113
    I agree. No way I would drive it without the PP installed. I can drive it without worrying about a pothole hit. Better safe than sorry.

  7. #7
    I wonder if these guys in TX are both just 'freelancing' the opinion that Z8 owners should just risk suffering this heart-braking and hugely expensive damage because they are cavalier by nature, or perhaps BMW NA are telling their service managers to say this because they only imported a limited number of PP's, and they are all but gone?

    Can anyone verify the numbers of PP's in the supply chain here and in Europe.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  8. #8
    Sport Button On - DSC Off
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    125
    I don't see any downside to installing the PP at all except for the cost. It doesn't harm anything in the car, and looks fine too. It is removable if in the way of servicing. It doesn't weigh much, doesn't add to heat, doesn't vibrate or make any noise. Other than the risk of a mistake during installation, I don't see what the problem is.

  9. #9
    Sport Button On
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    36

    Why wouldn't you do it?

    I agree with the all the comments on this thread...no downside with the fix...considerable downside without it...i remember that my attitude about driving a great car changed when confronted with the possibility of a catastrophic encounter with a pothole...that all subsided once the fix and new tires were installed...it isn't like the damaged cars were imaginery, so just tell the serivce manager not to get confused by the facts...good luck...bern

  10. #10
    Sport Button On
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    30
    Can anyone suggest, or maybe they have, which tires to switch to in addition to adding the PP? The previous owner just put a new set of Bridgestone Potenza RE 040s on her. I will be more than happy to rip those puppies off! I would also like to know when Cytoboy has his PP installed at the Clear Lake Dealer. I don't mind driving mine down there!

    Thanks,
    Sam

  11. #11
    Team Z8 KenZ8's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    462

    From a fellow Texan

    I fully support the installation of the PP, and have driven with a renewed enthusiasm since having it installed. I can highly recommend BMW of Austin even though it is a bit of a trip for both of you. Not only were they fully informed and supportive about the PP, they have a long track record of successful installations. I have seen several of the installs in person, and each one was perfect. I'm sure they could work out a loaner for the day, and you could explore Austin and the Hill Country while you are waiting. If interested, email me for contacts who will take very good care of you.
    As far as tires, I have the Bridgestone Pole Positions. They have great grip and good tread wear, as well as being quiet and reasonably priced. The only downside is that they tend to develop flat spots after a week or two of standing which take 5-10 miles of driving to iron out. This occurs from the nylon cap construction that they and Pirelli use. I understand that the PS2s do not share this construction, and will be my next set.
    Last edited by KenZ8; February 28th 2008 at 16:27. Reason: added info

  12. #12
    It has been so long since I tried any alternatives on the Z8 that I really can't comment the the broad range of tires out there, but I use the Michelin Pilot Sport 2's on my car, and am very, very happy with them.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  13. #13
    Sport Button On
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    30
    Thanks Andrew! I have PS2's on my M6 and love them. I will check on those this weekend! So you are saying scrap the Bridgestone Potenza, put PS2's on and get the PP installed? Will do and thanks to Ken Z8 for the Austin tip. It is a beautiful drive up to the hill contury and in the Z!!

  14. #14
    scrap the Bridgestone Potenza
    Yes, if they are the original run flat tires. Those are generally thought to be a large part of the issue as they are both very heavy and very stiff, so they can magnify the effect of a bad pothole hit.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  15. #15
    DSC Off CraZ8's Johnny Q's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    63
    The service advisor at my local dealer didn't even know what the PP was. I had to explain it to her a few times, very slowly. When she got back to me, she told me that it was unnecessary unless I planned to track the car and go off hard, or get the car airborne. She got her information from a BMWNA rep that was in the dealer that day.

    I have found another dealer to install the PP. I'll post if I run into any problems.
    2002 Silver/Black

  16. #16
    Z8 Ate My Homework! Norcal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    2,474
    Obviously they have all been drinking the "Performance Package" KoolAid!

  17. #17
    That KoolAid sure is clouding their reason and their responsibility, someone should tell them that denial isn't just a river in Egypt. It seems pretty scandalous to me that BMW NA is telling owners that their cars don't need this upgrade, especially when we know how many Z8's have been back to the Aluminum Repair Centers for new chassis due to both severe deformations, and cracked aluminum welds.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  18. #18
    Z8 Novice Zzzz8's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Posts
    19
    Quote Originally Posted by 2001bmwz8 View Post
    It is scheduled to have a complete service with Momentum BMW in Houston, Texas. I spoke with the service manager and he too discouraged the PP.
    I had spoken to John Crespino about 3 weeks ago at Momentum BMW about the installation process/procedure of the PP. He is the manager of Momentum Performance at the dealership, and they have done a number of installations without any problems. I plan to have my PP installed there when it comes in (I ordered it just yesterday).
    Frank Falbey
    62069 - Red // Crema

  19. #19
    Sport Button On
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    30
    Just an update: I just dropped my Z off to have the PS2's put on and I must say that I am going through withdraws not seeing my baby outside my office window. As a result of this forum I am going to Austin to have the PP installed. You guys are great!!

    THANKS!!!!!

  20. #20
    Sport Button On - DSC Off FWK-Z8's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    229
    Make sure you check the aim of your headlights before leaving the dealer. They have to disconnect the levelling linkage to install the PP. If they forget to reconnect it, as they did on my Z8, your headlights will be stuck on the fully dipped position, and the beams will bury themselves into the roadway about 25' in front of your car. It would make for a long, dark trip between Austin and Houston.

  21. #21
    Sport Button On
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    30
    I just picked my Z up with her new PS2's. I must say that the car drives and rides very different. More like a sports car that it is rather than a Cadilliac. I will get use to it as my other cars are M's - I am use to the feel of BMW's M rides.

  22. #22
    Sport Button On - DSC Off
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    125
    It was because of the enthusiasm for PS2s in this forum that I put them on my 540i first many months ago and what a big improvement that was! So, today I finally ordered another set for the Z8 and look forward to finally taking off the OE runflats which are feeling awfully hard and stiff these days.

  23. #23
    Z8Mania
    Guest
    I would speak with Bill Stuart or his understudy at BMW NA and see whom they suggest in your area for the work and if they could help arrange it. I would not have the person who doesn't want to do the work work on the car anymore. Its not worth the argument and in the future you will be on the wrong side of the argument with them. If they cannot suggest who should do the work- I would ask how much it would cost to have your car sent to BMW NAs facility either in NJ, SC or CA to have the work done. Also ask how long. It could be several months but the flip side is you know it will get done right. JMHO.