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Thread: ebay z8 ah60460

  1. #1
    Z8 Novice jvmax's Avatar
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    ebay z8 ah60460

    any info on this car, seems like a good deal at $117,500 with 6k miles

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2001-...orcev4exp=true

  2. #2
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    Macfly (Andrew) said:

    "Yes, cars 60001-60750 had a Vanos set up that was prone to failure, but I'd suggest replace the seals and sensors first. There was a seal kit released that helps solve the issues a few years back."

    Hayvenhurstkid said:

    "ZMates is correct. The first update, which was an important one, was done on any cars with a production date of 12/00 or later. Roughly, that starts with car number 60450."

    Search this site for vanos


    Regards,

    Phil
    61115 topaz/crema

  3. #3
    It sure looks nice in the pix, I'd still not buy it without getting a full inspection done.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  4. #4
    Z8 Guru 2112's Avatar
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    Did the VANOS fail or did they just make more and more noise on start up?

    Asking cause I don't know.
    .
    2000 Red over black
    heavily modified for performance. Although, not to the level of GM's car

  5. #5
    They were more prone to failure, but it doesn't mean they all failed by any means, and by this point I'd think all the ones that were going to would most likely have been fixed by now anyway.
    Andrew Macpherson

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  6. #6
    Z8 Ate My Homework! Norcal's Avatar
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    Unless it only has 6000 mi on it?

  7. #7
    Team Z8 ZMates's Avatar
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    The VANOS production date issue is purely a startup noise issue, not a failure issue. An oil pressure valve was added in Dec of 2000 that maintains the oil pressure in the VANOS when the engine is shut off. Check the production date for 60460 on www.realoem.com. My car, 60508 has the valve. Again, this is just a startup noise issue: even cars with the valve will lose pressure if the car sits for some time and will make a dieseling sound at startup.

    Some time in 2001 (forget when) a beefier spring was added to the VANOS. Again, this is just a noise issue that typically occurs around 100k miles. However, in this case the noise is continuous, not just at startup.
    Silver/black
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  8. #8
    Z8 Guru 2112's Avatar
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    That was my recollection, but at my age, things are starting to get jumbled.
    .
    2000 Red over black
    heavily modified for performance. Although, not to the level of GM's car

  9. #9
    From the very early days, before this board really got going and our main on line forum was the text based Roadfly, I do remember some early cars having complete vanos failures. It wasn't common, but it was also not isolated, and my memory is that the two (start up noise and failure) were considered to be related, but I don't remember how or why.
    Andrew Macpherson

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  10. #10
    Team Z8 ZMates's Avatar
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    Andrew, your experience goes back much further than mine. I was driving a 6 cylinder 5 series back then. All I know is that on the M5 board all the talk is about VANOS solenoid failures and VANOS noise, which I believe are unrelated.
    Silver/black
    Dinan S2 package: headers, throttle bodies, oversized MAFs, airfilters, anti-roll bars, lightweight flywheel
    Dinan by Brembo brake kit and monoball control arm bushings
    BBS forged individual wheels
    Quaife differential, 3.64:1 final drive
    Meisterschaft GT titanium mufflers
    K&W 3 way adjustable competition monotube dampers and monoball adjustable mounts
    CDV delete

  11. #11
    I don't think I've heard about vanos solenoid failures, what are they, how do they fail and what happens when they do?

    It's been a long time since anyone reported a full vanos failure, but I remember it involved replacing most of the valve train in the affected cylinder block, and back then was an 8-10k repair.
    Andrew Macpherson

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  12. #12
    Team Z8 ZMates's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by macfly View Post
    I don't think I've heard about vanos solenoid failures, what are they, how do they fail and what happens when they do?

    It's been a long time since anyone reported a full vanos failure, but I remember it involved replacing most of the valve train in the affected cylinder block, and back then was an 8-10k repair.
    The VANOS solenoid is the actuator that advances and retards the valve timing based upon an electrical signal from the engine ECU( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solenoid ).

    I haven't read anything about replacing the whole valve train, but replacing the whole VANOS unit is a major job and very expensive. It requires dismantling the heads.

    Apparently if you go into a typical BMW dealer with any kind of VANOS error code, 9 times out of 10 they will tell you that you need to replace the whole VANOS unit when you probably only have a problem with a solenoid. Replacing the solenoids is a much simpler job. Not sure what the typical failure mode is for the solenoids and the guys who offer to repair them aren't spilling the beans. Since it's electrical, though, it's probably a shorted coil, a bad solder joint, or a blown transistor/capacitor. The seals also fail, causing an oil leak.

    When the solenoid fails, the valve timing gets stuck in whatever position the solenoid is in after failure and the engine runs rough. It's not a catastrophic failure. So if you've heard about catastrophic failures of the VANOS, it's probably not a solenoid problem. I did a fair amount of reading on the topic in the M5 board and never ran across such a thing, but I could well have missed it. I am sure it has happened, but it doesn't seem to be a widespread occurrence.

    BMW also insist that the oil valve was added in Dec. 2000 to address the startup noise issue and not a VANOS failure mode. Of course the engine brace in the Z8 is a "performance package" too, so who knows. I just personally never heard anything like that, whereas we all know about the frame issues.
    Silver/black
    Dinan S2 package: headers, throttle bodies, oversized MAFs, airfilters, anti-roll bars, lightweight flywheel
    Dinan by Brembo brake kit and monoball control arm bushings
    BBS forged individual wheels
    Quaife differential, 3.64:1 final drive
    Meisterschaft GT titanium mufflers
    K&W 3 way adjustable competition monotube dampers and monoball adjustable mounts
    CDV delete

  13. #13
    It's really been a long time since this came up, so it could well be that those early failures were just the Vanos and not the full valve train.

    What I really remember is the worry everyone had at then at the cost consequence should it happen out of warranty, which back then was in the 8-10k range. If that sounds like the cost of a Vanos replacement in one head then that's what it was.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.