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Thread: Why I would never buy a new BMW again, BMW NA is simply a terrible company

  1. #1
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    Why I would never buy a new BMW again, BMW NA is simply a terrible company

    All of us who have Z8 have had, or know of someone who has had issues with their very expensive neon lights failing. Yes, the same neon lights BMW marketed would last the lifetime of the car! Yes, its in their press releases about the Z8. So too are their boasts how their aluminum chassis is so much stronger than other cars, such as the Ferrari 360 (named directly, and yet I've never heard of any bent frame issues on a 360).

    I purchased an SDrive35i manual shift twin turbo 6 from a BMW dealer after first contacting BMW NA to learn if there were any issues, such as past defects, recalls, etc. I bought the car based solely on the BMW Dealer's representations and those of BMW NA as well.

    When the car arrived it became apparent BMW NA (and the dealer) lied to me and failed to tell me that when the car was new it was repainted with 02 miles on the odometer. Not repainted by BMW in the complex factory paint job process, but by some local paint shop in Massachusetts. The paint job was such that, lets say it was obvious on delivery the car had been repainted.

    I learned this when the selling Dealer inadvertently sent me an internal warranty document that showed the car arrived at the U.S. dealer with paint defects. So they had it locally painted and with a substandard paint job. The evidence shows BMW NA knew of this when they lied to me and said there were no such issues.

    I contacted BMW NA about this issue, and I also raised the issue of the Z8 neon light failures and how BMW was on something like its fourth different version of those lights.....and how BMW in Europe did basically an unofficial recall and replaced European Z8 owners lights for free.

    How BMW in Europe took care of its customers shows us by comparison just how xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxty BMW NA is as they have done nothing to help those of us with failed neon lights.

    Long story short BMW NA said screw off and sue us, even though all I was asking for was they have the paint corrected by their own shop (the local BMW dealer's BMW paint shop).

    Instead, BMW NA would rather spend (literally) hundreds of thousands of dollars fighting the case rather than do the right thing and remedy their defects.

    Not only does BMW not stand behind its product, but even where it is blatantly wrong, they will engage in a war of attrition and try and crush the BMW owner.

    We are still in litigation and I made them an offer to settle the case, again, just for the cost to fix the paint issue (and not addressing other issues nor the issue of the neon Z8 lights), and again, BMW NA told me to screw off, they are "not interested" in settling the case.

    So often we hear about stories in the news where some guy goes "postal" and wreaks havoc on those who wronged him. In the old days, where justice was swift, people I suspect behaved better if for nothing else, fear of retribution. While I'm a level headed guy, some day they may piss off the wrong person.

    Regardless, BMW NA has shown its true colors over and again, whether the issue be our neon lights, E46 M3 engines grenading, bearing failures on the V10 and V8, cars spontaneously combusting, etc. In each instance BMW NA blamed the owners rather than "owning their xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" and remedying their cars' defects.

    So I will never by a new BMW again.

  2. #2
    All corporations are sociopaths, they all care about their shareholders more than their customers, we're just an inconvenient necessity. I'm sorry to hear you're having such a hard time them, hope it gets resolved to your satisfaction.

    Personally I also wouldn't buy another BMW either, but that is more of a quality issue than anything. I'm now a confirmed Mercedes man as my owner experience with my x4 SL's has been far superior, which in large part is because they make a better made and more reliable machine that has far less problems.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

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    Team Z8 Z8DinanS2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by macfly View Post
    All corporations are sociopaths, they all care about their shareholders more than their customers, we're just an inconvenient necessity. I'm sorry to hear you're having such a hard time them, hope it gets resolved to your satisfaction.

    Personally I also wouldn't buy another BMW either, but that is more of a quality issue than anything. I'm now a confirmed Mercedes man as my owner experience with my x4 SL's has been far superior, which in large part is because they make a better made and more reliable machine that has far less problems.

    I know what you mean! Frankly, my SL600 was probably the best built car I've owned in terms of over engineering. The R230 put all similar era BMWs to shame.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Z8DinanS2 View Post
    All of us who have Z8 have had, or know of someone who has had issues with their very expensive neon lights failing. Yes, the same neon lights BMW marketed would last the lifetime of the car! Yes, its in their press releases about the Z8. So too are their boasts how their aluminum chassis is so much stronger than other cars, such as the Ferrari 360 (named directly, and yet I've never heard of any bent frame issues on a 360).

    I purchased an SDrive35i manual shift twin turbo 6 from a BMW dealer after first contacting BMW NA to learn if there were any issues, such as past defects, recalls, etc. I bought the car based solely on the BMW Dealer's representations and those of BMW NA as well.

    When the car arrived it became apparent BMW NA (and the dealer) lied to me and failed to tell me that when the car was new it was repainted with 02 miles on the odometer. Not repainted by BMW in the complex factory paint job process, but by some local paint shop in Massachusetts. The paint job was such that, lets say it was obvious on delivery the car had been repainted.

    I learned this when the selling Dealer inadvertently sent me an internal warranty document that showed the car arrived at the U.S. dealer with paint defects. So they had it locally painted and with a substandard paint job. The evidence shows BMW NA knew of this when they lied to me and said there were no such issues.

    I contacted BMW NA about this issue, and I also raised the issue of the Z8 neon light failures and how BMW was on something like its fourth different version of those lights.....and how BMW in Europe did basically an unofficial recall and replaced European Z8 owners lights for free.

    How BMW in Europe took care of its customers shows us by comparison just how xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxty BMW NA is as they have done nothing to help those of us with failed neon lights.

    Long story short BMW NA said screw off and sue us, even though all I was asking for was they have the paint corrected by their own shop (the local BMW dealer's BMW paint shop).

    Instead, BMW NA would rather spend (literally) hundreds of thousands of dollars fighting the case rather than do the right thing and remedy their defects.

    Not only does BMW not stand behind its product, but even where it is blatantly wrong, they will engage in a war of attrition and try and crush the BMW owner.

    We are still in litigation and I made them an offer to settle the case, again, just for the cost to fix the paint issue (and not addressing other issues nor the issue of the neon Z8 lights), and again, BMW NA told me to screw off, they are "not interested" in settling the case.

    So often we hear about stories in the news where some guy goes "postal" and wreaks havoc on those who wronged him. In the old days, where justice was swift, people I suspect behaved better if for nothing else, fear of retribution. While I'm a level headed guy, some day they may piss off the wrong person.

    Regardless, BMW NA has shown its true colors over and again, whether the issue be our neon lights, E46 M3 engines grenading, bearing failures on the V10 and V8, cars spontaneously combusting, etc. In each instance BMW NA blamed the owners rather than "owning their xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" and remedying their cars' defects.

    So I will never by a new BMW again.
    Neither will I. They are all so butt ugly

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkat View Post
    Neither will I. They are all so butt ugly
    Their inner true self now reflected in their "butt ugly" exterior appearance. Who on earth would by a BMW with that new hideous grill. Makes a Pontiac Aztec look good by comparison

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    I have owned a new 1974 2002, a 3.0 CSi, and two Z8’s-2000 Topaz and currently a 2002 Silver. My wife swears by her 2018 X5. We have also owned a 2010 535Xi wagon. We have never had problems with these cars but the new ones are sure ugly. Andrew is completely on target by describing corporations as sociopathic.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryG View Post
    I have owned a new 1974 2002, a 3.0 CSi, and two Z8’s-2000 Topaz and currently a 2002 Silver. My wife swears by her 2018 X5. We have also owned a 2010 535Xi wagon. We have never had problems with these cars but the new ones are sure ugly. Andrew is completely on target by describing corporations as sociopathic.
    The test for me is not when times are good, but when times are bad, who has your back? It's easy to be a fair weather friend, but when the chips are down we see a person or corporations true colors. Aston Martin is a great company, until things go wrong, and then they are awful. On the other hand, I have found Ferrari to be more upstanding than either BMW or Aston Martin.

    Agreed on corporations being sociopaths, the more I think about it, the more true it can be and why its so important for a corporation to show it is not sociopathic. BMW NA has not shown this.

  8. #8
    Interesting thread… Personally between my wife and myself we have had ten or so BMWs - from (316, 325ES, 525, 540 Sport, M5, multiple X3’s and the Z8). Most of them very trouble free and very pleasurable and (some) very exciting to drive and enjoy. Overall the service and extra care especially for the Z8 (Bill Stewart especially, but also the local dealership even today) has been great.

    It is also interesting to note how this unique group is so hateful against corporations as I would believe many of us have had good or great careers within a corporate structure making it possible to enjoy and treasure Z8 ownership.

    Yes, there are frustrations - but mostly First World Problems…
    Skip Hammerman

    2002 BMW Z8 - Meisterschaft GT, PP installed, CDV delete. 110,000+ Mile Club
    2013 BMW X3
    2015 Porsche 911 Targa 4S

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musta10000 View Post
    Interesting thread… Personally between my wife and myself we have had ten or so BMWs - from (316, 325ES, 525, 540 Sport, M5, multiple X3’s and the Z8). Most of them very trouble free and very pleasurable and (some) very exciting to drive and enjoy. Overall the service and extra care especially for the Z8 (Bill Stewart especially, but also the local dealership even today) has been great.

    It is also interesting to note how this unique group is so hateful against corporations as I would believe many of us have had good or great careers within a corporate structure making it possible to enjoy and treasure Z8 ownership.

    Yes, there are frustrations - but mostly First World Problems…

    Did you have the M5 with the V10 with the bearing problems that BMW never took responsibility for? https://www.m5board.com/threads/rod-...awsuit.509722/
    Or the M3 engine problems that BMW refused to acknowledge so a class aciton was filed?
    https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-...ngine-failure/
    E46 M3 Engine failures that for the longest time BMW blamed on the owners?
    https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=342850
    Or the BMWs that spontaneously combusted and BMW did nothing until ABC news did a feature story?
    BMW advised people not to park their BMW in their garage to avoid burning their houses down! BMW did nothing until the media spotlight was on them.
    https://abcnews.go.com/US/bmw-recall...ry?id=50922136

    I could go on and on and on.

    Perhaps you've not heard that BMW marketed the Z8, in writing, touting the virtues of the neon lights and how they would last the lifetime of the car?

    And yet now despite super low miles and low usage, so many have failed? I replaced my Mercedes SL65 taill light and it cost me a few hundred dollars for a truly beautiful light assembly. This was after someone backed into it and broke it, not due to failure, as is the case with the BMW Z8 lights.

    And yet, the SL65 (~$200k car) light cost a few hundred dollars whereas the Z8 lights cost thousands of dollars.....and will likely fail again!

    Irrefutable that BMW replaced European customers lights for free but then BMW NA shafted its American customers.

    Really, what more do you need to realize this is not a good company, BMW NA?

    Its like, how many examples does one need to discern true character rather than having they themselves be burned?

  10. #10
    It is also interesting to note how this unique group is so hateful against corporations as I would believe many of us have had good or great careers within a corporate structure making it possible to enjoy and treasure Z8 ownership.
    Working as a freelancer within the media has certainly colored my vision. I've witnessed so many wonderful people be treated like disposable chattel, ushered out of their chairs before they get too expensive, or heavens forbid worthy of a pension. I have seen the sociopathy of these corporations make so, so many talented and beautiful souls the victims of their careless cruelty.

    I'm a big believer in the old idea of the 'corporate charter' where corporations have to show the benefits they bring to the community, and be a part of the community. Since I arrived in the US almost 40 years ago I have seen this country's manufacturing, ship building, steel and so many other industries shuttered and off-shored for short term profits. Today 100% of our medicine is manufactured outside of America, as so too are the chips which are so central to our electronic lives. This land has been hollowed out by the greed of the corporations who care nothing for the people who toiled to make them what they are.

    At heart I am a capitalist and more of a libertarian than a red or blue, but I also believe in country, community and corporate responsibility. I came to America to be a part of something incredible, but instead I've been a witness to an awful unravelling. Sure, I could blame Washington with its ridiculous systems of bribery and corruption wearing the lipstick of lobbying, or the privately owned Federal Reserve system set up by the 19th century banking barons to cement their power and control, but in the end it's the short sighted greed of the corporations that I see as having done the most to undermine our nation.

    That said, it's just a personal reflection from my perspective, obviously you have a more favorable one.
    Andrew Macpherson

    Expert Z8 Inspections, with full support for both Z8 sale and purchases.

  11. #11
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    Valid points Andrew. Corporations looking quarter to quarter in order to maximize short term profits lack the vision and morality of the long-term societal view. I remember years ago hearing how Japanese corporations would have five and ten year plans whereas American corps were literally quarter to quarter. A supreme court that further empowers already powerful and empowered corporations greatly exacerbates the problem that ultimately undermines this nation in every way. As some jest, we'd have a real problem in a conflict with China because how could we run our military and economy if we couldn't buy all that we need as we shuttered our own manufacturing in pursuit of short term profit maximization. (As you duly noted.)

    What's sad for me is cars and car companies began with passion! They were in many ways anti-corporate. Guys who wanted to go fast and have fun and not be constrained. Of course, that world is fading into the past rapidly. The days of Enzo Ferrari and Carrol Shelby and Feruccio Lamborghini are gone

    Even BMW, who used to be a small niche company, has become a massive global conglomerate, but what's worse, is the USA's BMW NA is far worse than BMW AG it would seem. At least BMW AG replaced European owners' taillights whereas BMW NA told us they don't give a rat's butt about us.

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